We do not need our bodies once we leave this world regardless of what you think happens after we die. We should be focused on curing diseases and extending the life of living humans. Science would go so far if we used human bodies after death instead of requiring people to give consent to something they don’t need.
having an opt-out policy instead if an opt-in policy would allow those that care enough to opt out, but allow science and organ donation to become the cultural norm.
if you opt out, you are no longer eligible to receive organs if you need them
i disagree here. someone caring enough to opt out shouldnt be considered a detriment to the program - i dont think a punishment here is suitable; after all, in my country (usa) we want people to have different viewpoints from our own (as much as the current racist president would probably despise that phrase, it is still a strong sentiment among the people).
having body/organ donations as a normal part of society would make a plethora of organs and bodies available - having a couple fewer bodies shouldnt be reprimanded.
This doesnt clear the anti discrimination bare minimum standard for a rule given its okay if a religion says no donation and people apply that to themselves the same way it’s okay if a person says that for themselves.
a religioun says no pork, is subsidising food (which includes pork) racist?
Pretty certain that’s not true in the US. Where are you?
sorry, I was saying that it should be like that, not that it is
sorry, I was saying that it should be like that, not that it is
There was a scandal in the US where bodies being donated to ‘science’ were used for munitions testing by the us military. So the “who receives said body” is very important.
Yeah but there you’re talking about the US where no one gives a fuck about anything but money.
I fully agree that after tmdeath all bodies should be used automatically for either organ donation or science. I’m dead already, let my (un)timely demise be the reason why someone else can be helped
Their point is you cannot just use a blanket term such as “for science” and expect everyone else to know what is and isn’t considered appropriate. As they said, those bodies were still used “for science”… military science and weapons testing. It is still technically “for science”.
The discussion shouldn’t be on what we personally find appropriate, instead we must first determine who has authority over the cadaver. It is no longer a person with autonomy, just a bag of flesh and bone, an inanimate object. Who owns it? The next of kin? The state? Some other third entity?
Once this question is answered, it will be up to them what ultimately happens to the cadaver.
Fair enough
My point was more about that if my body gets used for science in say, Canada or Europe, i can probably rest easily (pun intended) knowing that my remains will be treated with respect.
In the USA its a damn near guarantee that someone will use my body in a YouTube video to score a few cheap points
I was more going off about how in the US way too many people respect nothing, not even the dead, and that everything has been cheapened
Technically speaking, those bodies were used for science. Just they were used for military science, not health sciences.
“Put 'em in the movies!” - Bill Hicks
He was talking about terminal and hospice patients. People who were still alive
“Holy shit, Jackie Chan kicked grammas head off”
Some doctors and scientists are really fucked up and value their experiements over human life. If bodies become a resource they can claim, some patients may not get the care they deserve because the body would be valuable to their studies and experiments.
There is also concerns for the organ market.
Culturally, humans have long standing and many unique traditions for caring for their dead. Someone and their remaining family should not be denied their funeral rights because science wants their body.
A better option would be increasing the amount of awareness for these programs so that people willing to donate their body or organs are informed of their existence and goals and can choose to donate.
I disagree.
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-bodybrokers-industry/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC1800998/
the list is endless. humans are shit, even after you’re dead.
I’ll take my cremation and fuck humanity of any further support.
In fairness, pretty much any subject will have some negatives that could be pointed to and touted as an excuse for not doing something.
If there’s even a 1% chance of your body being properly useful to science in some way, and therefore humanity at large, it’s worth the odds.
Though I’d bet good money that the amount of mutilation and whatnot isn’t particularly common for science bound bodies. Much easier to steal some organs from the morgue bodies marked for non collection.
The morgue bodies may not have as high quality of organs or may not match genetically. If a billionaire puts a bounty on a liver that fits them genetically and has barely been abused, someone is going to be looking to cash in.
I wish I could live in that timeline where all morgue attendants got a page when the world’s 1% needs a good looking kidney hahaha.
If there’s even a 1% chance of your body being properly useful to science in some way, and therefore humanity at large, it’s worth the odds.
my body, my choice. if body donation was mandatory I’d self-immolate so there’s nothing left after.
I don’t know why body autonomy is such a hard concept to grasp for people. literally the only thing you can “own” is yourself. this ownership doesn’t end after death, you just can’t make decisions known after your death. this is why it’s always been taboo to perform anything but last rites to the dead.
just to note, I’m not religious at all. I believe that after death you cease to exist. that said, the image of my body being slaughtered like a pig for some corporate gains makes me sick and honestly might turn me into an extremist faction and compel me to take action against corporate interests.
Just switch it to opt out, not opt in. In Australia you can opt in to organ donation but many people don’t care either way. My partner would definitely opt out because they don’t feel OK with it, and fair enough, but most people actually don’t care and would go with the default.
This is a proper unpopular opinion because, as someone who received an organ transplant from a deceased donor, I disagree with it.
I am a huge advocate for organ donation for obvious reasons but I don’t think it should come at the cost of bodily autonomy.
Well it’s not exactly autonomy if you’re dead. It’s not you anymore, or even your body, it’s just an empty body. And it’s not like you can use it. In my mind it’s equivalent to “Nobody gets my car when I die. I want it to be buried”
Bodily autonomy is the concept that individuals have the right to make their own decisions about their bodies and reproductive health, without coercion or external interference. This includes the freedom to choose whether to have an abortion, use contraception, or consent to medical procedures. It is considered a fundamental human right and is closely linked to other rights like privacy, equality, and bodily integrity.
You make the decision when you’re still alive.
If my body is valuable my family should get paid for it. The healthcare industry certainly is when they use the organs.
Probably why there’s such a push for people to become donors. Don’t consider the needs of the sick, but of the shareholders.
Yeah. I’d happily give it for free if the whole system was structured that way but if there’s profit being made from me I want my family to get a cut.
Tell them to have a yard sale when you go. Cut out the middle man and make a few bucks on some home-grown organ meats.
It’s worth giving this paper from 2021 a read. The basic conclusion is that shifting away from an opt-in organ donation system does not increase the number of actual organs available, because the number of people willing to donate organs is not the (only) bottleneck in obtaining usable organs.
Soon that will change since we’re starting to genetically modify pigs to grow human organs.
Do they even need the pigs anymore? Last I heard they could grow them with stem cells, a scaffolding and a nutrient bath.
Giving pigs scaffolding and baths‽ Those swine!
Here in the UK all everyone is automatically on the donation list, you have to opt out, not opt in like a lot of countries.
All bodies should be automatically given to science and organ donation upon death.
Let me get that right. What you’re proposing is that every human is a burlap $ack full of $$$ if not ruined by cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, or cancer from micro plastics is to be given away for free with zero compensation to the grieving family and all $xx,xxx to $xxx,xxx profits for said sold organ going to some executive?
¡Fuuuuuuuuck that shit!
¿You think this kid’s knee or kidney is gonna pay for someone not in this blood line’s Ferrari?
¡You’re out of your god damn mind!
My next of kin get market value of that organ or my shit gets burnt to ash and pressed into vinyl records so I can continue going to raves even after I am dead.
Capitalism at its finest my friends.
More like cocaine at it’s finest
in america your body is likely to go to the military so some 19 year old can cut off your head and shove fireworks in the hole
I want my remains spread around Disney World. Also I do not wish to be cremated.
Problem is, lots of them just get given to cops to play with.
If i knew it was gonna get cut up to train new surgeons or study how i died or figure out how i didn’t so many times, I’d be on board.
But there’s no way yo be sure it won’t be a chew toy for cops. So I’ll be cremated.
You do have sources for a claim that fucking extreme, right?
Sure. But if you cared and didn’t just want to argue, you’d have searched it by now. I’m not childish enough to think good sources will convince anyone of anything.
That’s what someone who made shit up would say.
You can check. I think someone else cited a source.
Congrats, you work against your own causes. If you aren’t willing (or more likely able) to back up your claims, I’m just gonna assume you’re full of shit and move on 🤷♂️
Exactly.
In my experience, a good source doesn’t change that.
Sorry wait what are the cops doing with the bodies?
Basically chew toy.
No one person can make that determination or all of us. Also, have you looked into what actually happens when a body gets donated. Here is John Oliver’s investigation:
I live in Flanders, Belgium and we have an opt-out system of sorts. Everyone is a donor, unless official objections were made. That sounds great, but doctors need to ascertain if there are no objections, even informal ones.
So it kind of boils down to doctors still having to ask your next of kin. But - according to data from UZ Leuven, one of our biggest hospitals - asking ‘are there any objections to the normal course of events’ works better than ‘do you wish to donate you loved ones organs’. Especially during a time of grief. It says Belgium has about 30 donors per million, whereas Germany and The Netherlands have about 15. (Data from 2024)
Because of this system you can still also officially state that your organs are to be donated if possible. And apparently you can do so from the age of 12 onwards. If you do so, no questions are asked and no one is able to object.
Tl;dr In Belgium we have an opt-out system, but it’s not bulletproof. And it doesn’t result in an enormous amount of donations. There are still waiting lists, though there are more donations than in some of our neighbouring countries. Reality is messy!
Why don’t they require people to go to a government building and sign paperwork to get off then get it added to your state ID that can be scanned at death to tell if you’re an opt out
