Killing a guy who is not trying to kill you is always grossly disproportionate, and murder is not an unreasonable label. The idea that just because a guy is trespassing on your property you can enact your heinous fantasies of violent death on them is deeply, deply psychopathic.
YOU are psychopathic. You have your own life and your family’s lives to protect. Why should a violent criminal have more right to life that your own innocent family?
If someone is breaking into your home, you should assume the worst, and defend your home and family to the extreme.
Seriously. So many psycho rapist apologists in this thread. They bend over backwards to find any excuse why the potential rapist deserves the benefit of the doubt, but in turn they don’t extend that grace to the potential victim. I believe victims, that’s why I fully support home intruders being shot.
Well yeah obviously you shouldn’t break into houses. You also shouldn’t cross the road when the pedestrian light is red, but if you do that doesn’t justify a driver not trying to avoid killing you. People do stupid, dangerous and selfish shit, but death doesn’t have to be the penalty.
You also shouldn’t cross the road when the pedestrian light is red
there are laws that specifically state that. there are also laws that specifically protect pedestrians and give them the right-of-way.
there are laws in place that specifically state not to break into homes. there are no laws that protect people from burglarizing a home. this is why damages are usually considered a “civil matter” because it’s a disagreement between two parties that do not interest the general public.
if you don’t want to be shot, don’t force your way into places where you will be shot, the law and public opinion will not be on your side.
In many countries, there actually are laws requiring homeowners to keep their property reasonably safe for trespassers, even thieves. Mine is one. There was a case a few years ago where a guy got in serious trouble for deliberately planting exposed nails pointing out of his floorboards in his disused apartment to injure thieves.
Those laws are to protect innocent people that might need to be in your home when you’re not there. Like police performing a welfare check on people. Man traps are illegal because you can’t ensure they only target unlawful intruders. And, most crucially, a trap is intended for cases where you are not present. If you’re not present, no threat to your person can exist, only your property.
Man traps and shooting someone in self defense are completely different scenarios. You’re only using a firearm to defend yourself if you are physically present and at risk.
Nonverbal communication exists. Breaking into someone’s house, especially at night, is telling the people inside, “I’m rape to rape or murder you.”
Sorry, but victims have a right to defend themselves. They have a right to use lethal violence to defend themselves. You break into someone’s home and threaten the life of another? Getting shot is perfectly proportionate. “Grossly disproportionate” my ass. Lethal violence is a perfectly proportionate response to rape and murder.
Someone unknown forces their way into your shelter filled with loved ones. Attacking them is “deeply psychopathic”? My friend, this is the most natural response to such an event, to the point it transcents time, place and even species.
Yes, trying to kill them is. There’s a world of difference between threatening/attacking them to get them to leave, and genuinely trying to end their life. It disgusting that people try to blur that line.
The person in the image wasn’t trying to end a life. They just used a firearm to disable an intruder and save their own life. Same thing for nearly everyone who uses a weapon in self defense. They’re not trying to kill the rapist. But often disabling the rapist does lead to their death. Don’t be a rapist if you don’t want to get shot.
Conflicts are messy, unpredictable. The only way you could expect someone to act measured is if they have a lot of experience with such situations. And even then you never know what the other person wants.
You dont accidentally shoot a guy four times and then have no regrets. The guy here just wanted to kill. Hesistating before you take a persons life isn’t particularly ‘measured’, it’s just normal human behaviour
You can fire a warning shot. A thief wants to steal stuff, they dont want to get involved in a life-or-death situation. If there’s a clear route out of the house and serious danger inside, they will run.
Frankly we have no idea how the greentext scenario actually played out, if it’s true.
…But home invasions are not neat, and don’t always follow rationality. People are scared as shit. They are on edge, fearing for their life/family, and aren’t always in their right mind.
Just this year, some mentally ill guy found an unlocked slider door to our neighbor’s home and fucked up the place for no discernible reason. I’ve been on a jury to an even messier murder case, where the defendant technically shot too quickly, and logically should have done what you said; yet I probably would have done the exact same thing in their shoes, on the spot like that.
It’s easy to play out some more rational action plan in your head, after the fact, sure, but I’m just saying that’s often not how it goes.
This all happens in seconds while under stress. Hesitating is normal, freezing is normal, attacking is normal. Depends on the person. You don’t get to think and consider, you react on instinct. In this case, the guy shot the intruder until he stopped moving.
You can’t know that someone who is breaking into your own home is not ready to kill you. There are people out there who are ready to kill just to get your valuables. Being hesitant could potentially mean that you end up dead cos the intruder shoots first since they don’t hesitate.
If you break into someones home, you gotta be ready to face the consequences.
Killing a guy who is not trying to kill you is always grossly disproportionate, and murder is not an unreasonable label. The idea that just because a guy is trespassing on your property you can enact your heinous fantasies of violent death on them is deeply, deply psychopathic.
YOU are psychopathic. You have your own life and your family’s lives to protect. Why should a violent criminal have more right to life that your own innocent family?
If someone is breaking into your home, you should assume the worst, and defend your home and family to the extreme.
Seriously. So many psycho rapist apologists in this thread. They bend over backwards to find any excuse why the potential rapist deserves the benefit of the doubt, but in turn they don’t extend that grace to the potential victim. I believe victims, that’s why I fully support home intruders being shot.
I don’t blame the boiling pot that burns me when I shove my fist into the boiling water.
don’t go into dangerous places at dangerous times with dangerous people, don’t get shot.
seems like pretty sound logic to me.
Well yeah obviously you shouldn’t break into houses. You also shouldn’t cross the road when the pedestrian light is red, but if you do that doesn’t justify a driver not trying to avoid killing you. People do stupid, dangerous and selfish shit, but death doesn’t have to be the penalty.
there are laws that specifically state that. there are also laws that specifically protect pedestrians and give them the right-of-way.
there are laws in place that specifically state not to break into homes. there are no laws that protect people from burglarizing a home. this is why damages are usually considered a “civil matter” because it’s a disagreement between two parties that do not interest the general public.
if you don’t want to be shot, don’t force your way into places where you will be shot, the law and public opinion will not be on your side.
In many countries, there actually are laws requiring homeowners to keep their property reasonably safe for trespassers, even thieves. Mine is one. There was a case a few years ago where a guy got in serious trouble for deliberately planting exposed nails pointing out of his floorboards in his disused apartment to injure thieves.
Those laws are to protect innocent people that might need to be in your home when you’re not there. Like police performing a welfare check on people. Man traps are illegal because you can’t ensure they only target unlawful intruders. And, most crucially, a trap is intended for cases where you are not present. If you’re not present, no threat to your person can exist, only your property.
Man traps and shooting someone in self defense are completely different scenarios. You’re only using a firearm to defend yourself if you are physically present and at risk.
The laws are enforced in the same way when criminals are injured. The laws exist to protect anyone in the the property.
Nonverbal communication exists. Breaking into someone’s house, especially at night, is telling the people inside, “I’m rape to rape or murder you.”
Sorry, but victims have a right to defend themselves. They have a right to use lethal violence to defend themselves. You break into someone’s home and threaten the life of another? Getting shot is perfectly proportionate. “Grossly disproportionate” my ass. Lethal violence is a perfectly proportionate response to rape and murder.
Someone unknown forces their way into your shelter filled with loved ones. Attacking them is “deeply psychopathic”? My friend, this is the most natural response to such an event, to the point it transcents time, place and even species.
Yes, trying to kill them is. There’s a world of difference between threatening/attacking them to get them to leave, and genuinely trying to end their life. It disgusting that people try to blur that line.
The person in the image wasn’t trying to end a life. They just used a firearm to disable an intruder and save their own life. Same thing for nearly everyone who uses a weapon in self defense. They’re not trying to kill the rapist. But often disabling the rapist does lead to their death. Don’t be a rapist if you don’t want to get shot.
Conflicts are messy, unpredictable. The only way you could expect someone to act measured is if they have a lot of experience with such situations. And even then you never know what the other person wants.
You dont accidentally shoot a guy four times and then have no regrets. The guy here just wanted to kill. Hesistating before you take a persons life isn’t particularly ‘measured’, it’s just normal human behaviour
If you pull the trigger on someone without intending to kill you’re insane. You can’t predictably incapacitate without killing with a firearm.
You can fire a warning shot. A thief wants to steal stuff, they dont want to get involved in a life-or-death situation. If there’s a clear route out of the house and serious danger inside, they will run.
That’s not the way the law works.
Thats the way human beings work
Frankly we have no idea how the greentext scenario actually played out, if it’s true.
…But home invasions are not neat, and don’t always follow rationality. People are scared as shit. They are on edge, fearing for their life/family, and aren’t always in their right mind.
Just this year, some mentally ill guy found an unlocked slider door to our neighbor’s home and fucked up the place for no discernible reason. I’ve been on a jury to an even messier murder case, where the defendant technically shot too quickly, and logically should have done what you said; yet I probably would have done the exact same thing in their shoes, on the spot like that.
It’s easy to play out some more rational action plan in your head, after the fact, sure, but I’m just saying that’s often not how it goes.
This all happens in seconds while under stress. Hesitating is normal, freezing is normal, attacking is normal. Depends on the person. You don’t get to think and consider, you react on instinct. In this case, the guy shot the intruder until he stopped moving.
You can’t know that someone who is breaking into your own home is not ready to kill you. There are people out there who are ready to kill just to get your valuables. Being hesitant could potentially mean that you end up dead cos the intruder shoots first since they don’t hesitate. If you break into someones home, you gotta be ready to face the consequences.