In your humble opinion, are the majority of the homeless people responsible for the situation they are in? IOW: do they deserve to be homeless, because it is their personal failure or do they not, because they are a victim of the circumstances (the reasons they are where they are are largely out of their control)? Have you ever talked to homeless people? Are they really just “bad people” and “will never change” or are they hardworking individuals who’ve just had a punch by life that they were unable to stand after?
Not even the bad ones who will never change deserve to be stuck on the cold streets. I’ve been homeless, it was brief, but it fucking sucked, especially since I was a full time student.
A large portion of homeless people have just fallen on hard times. The rest need support, for many it’s help with drugs, others it’s mental illness, and still others just need some stability for a bit so they can build themselves back up.
And some can’t be helped, nothing will fix them, and they may not even want it. We can’t know who they are until we help the rest, and everyone deserves for them not to be freezing to death on the street
I’ve been applying to jobs for the last 6 months, the homeless are a product of a weak system that doesn’t care to help.
Hate to break it to you, pal, but some people would make the opposite conclusion, that is being: you’re the problem.
That seems to be a tradition in late stage capitalism. Like I’m the problem for the high cost of living, gas prices, rent, food.
absolutely not. 100% its mental illness or circumstances largely beyond their control and what is in their control is a coin flip on what they should have done argued by monday morning quarterbacks. they should have zigged when they zagged. Crap societies like to have some as its the ultimate threat to have hanging over the head of the working class.
The framing of linking suffering to a personal failing is a mistake. No one “deserves” to be homeless or to go hungry. You can be an asshole, or even a criminal, and you still deserve to have your basic needs met. Maybe you won’t be an asshole if you’re not hungry and can receive mental health care.
A few, probably. I’ve never met one that wasn’t fucked over by the system, tho.
Nobody deserves to be neglected. Even if it is a result of their choices.
So not even murderers who kill for personal gain (by choice)?
100%. that home should even be provided by the state along with food and a toilet and bars.
Yes. Even murderers who kill for personal gain.
I’ll say something stupid here, are drunk driving accidents just because the guy was slightly drunk or because he wasn’t skilled enough at driving? I’d bet an f1 driver could survive driving on a regular neighborhood off skill alone, while a regular person could prob crash and burn. I think being homeless is the same as drinking alcohol while driving, the alcohol being the social difficulties/outside circumstances and then your personal skill in managing life/jobs. I think it’s both, but after you become homeless for a while, its harder to get back on track so you can spiral down and then it’s harder.
sometimes yes, mostly no.
homelessness isn’t so black and white cut and dry. its causes are as numerous as the victims that exist.
nobody deserves to be homeless.
the worst thing about the homeless is that you’re always one bad day away from joining them.
I only ever go to know the situation of one homeless person closer. It was in Poland, about 25 years ago… I was told that this guy went from orphanage straight to the military and when he go out, after years of living under very strict rules he simply wasn’t able to/didn’t wan to follow any orders anymore. When some people helped him find a job he didn’t show up the first day there was a good weather because he preferred to go for a walk. So not a bad person but also not a hardworking person. Simply someone that went trough a bad system and wasn’t prepared to function in a society. Every case is different.
Answering in good faith as someone recovering from homelessness, knowing this post is so severely downvoted and will probably be removed or ignored.
In your humble opinion, are the majority of the homeless people responsible for the situation they are in?
No.
For this and the rest of your questions there are 5 main types of ‘homeless’ and all categories below often find themselves into multiple of these categories the longer they are homeless.
Archetype 1, The Victim: Nearly all homeless technically fall into this category, but I’m going to define this as you did, ‘victim of circumstances outside of their control.’ All homeless start out like this. Either from being born mentally ill and no longer having care, losing a job, losing a house, running away from abusive parents, running away from other domestic violence, being a part of the foster care system, or getting addicted to drugs (most commonly through the opioid epidemic.) But to further clarify and deal with annoying people:
Archetype 2, The Mentally ill: American society specifically is not built to handle those that cannot help themselves. It is so violently against the chronically ill and mentally ill, that the majority of those suffering from severe illness of any type will end up homeless at some point during their lives (including ‘couch surfing’ as homeless). Most homeless people will eventually become mentally ill if they stay on the streets longer than six months. Given the lack of available reasonable resources to get out of homelessness, this is a large minority of The Victims.
Archetype 3, The Druggie: Drug addiction is a disease, a disease you are either genetically predisposed to, or not. It can start as a choice, but does not always start as a choice. Stopping is not a choice most can physically make. This, like all addictions, will only end when it is ended. Barring arguably divine intervention only hitting rock bottom and staying there can truly ‘cure’ someone of drug addiction. So once they reach the end of their grace with their loved ones and friends, they’re still alive, but cannot maintain enough free floating cash to maintain a home (if they could even qualify)
Archetype 4, The Victim, but old: In many parts of the country you cannot get a job past a certain age, you will be discriminated against. And it will be done automatically in a plausibly deniable way. This gap usually exists between 55 and 62. This is the age you are most like to become homeless for the first time as of 2020. You get laid off, you get fired, you get constructively let go, you don’t have social security, you don’t have a good enough body for general labor, you will be discriminated against severely by pretty much everyone hiring… and then you end up homeless. And until you get your social security, you will stay homeless, as older people (before social security age) are usually at the bottom of the list for grants (specifically older white men have the least available options and programs to help them out of homelessness).
Archetype 5, (Rare) (Epic) (Legendary) The Actually Prefers Homeless: Easily the 0.001% of homeless people. These are never the ones you have ever seen on a broadcast or news report, except when they rarely get caught. They don’t and won’t ever fully fit into society, as they fundamentally reject the concept. Everyone else can and has been cured before, this is the only archetype that ‘deserves’ to be homeless, because it is genuinely the only thing they want in life.
Thank you for bringing such a well thought out answer to a topic so often lacking serious understanding of society’s failures and the cascade of struggles. Irl I make a point to acknowledge that I’ve been homeless (very briefly) and housing insecure when these topics come up because so many people think of homeless people as fundamentally alien, and I hope that by being open about such experiences I can help them understand that homelessness is something even someone like me can have experienced
This is a really well thought out reply and thank you for bringing the empathy and knowledge this topic needs.
- How do we define memtal illness? Is it just about anything that bars you from avhieving social success? Then doesn’t it fully eliminate the choice factor?
- Rightwingers would argue that starting drugs (and even continuing using on early stages) IS a choice.
First, sorry for the late reply, this did not show up in my notifications for some reason.
How do we define memtal illness? Is it just about anything that bars you from avhieving social success? Then doesn’t it fully eliminate the choice factor?
Mental illness, specifically disorders, is any category of psychiatric illness that interferes with daily life. I used it in two ways. Many who develop a severe mental illness, say schizophrenia, schizoaffective disorder, clinical depression, and even cases like mild to severe autism, will end up homeless. Sometimes this is arguably a choice, as in their disorders lead them to act in ways that others perceive as a voluntary action, which supports the far-right narrative you’re basing your argument on. Most of the time this is not a choice.
Additionally, the severe stress of homelessness has been well documented to cause PTS in otherwise mentally healthy people. This then can cascade into other mental illness, which can lead people to either use drugs to calm themselves (as medical care is out of the question), or can result in the ‘voluntary’ choice of not seeking help after enough rejections. This is where the myth of ‘they don’t want help they want to keep doing drugs,’ lie comes from. People with severe PTSD from homelessness that have found a way to cope with the damage that state of being has done to their brain. When you are in survival mode constantly and find something to give you peace, whatever it may be, that is what your brain will fervently keep trying to get even if it is illogical or in other words bad for you in the long run. Which leads us to:
Rightwingers would argue that starting drugs (and even continuing using on early stages) IS a choice.
And in some select cases, they’re right. But they’re also not capable of understanding the concept of choice.
If I force you into labor at an early age, force you to work unsafely in such a way as to cause chronic pain, and then force healthcare costs to be unobtainable for you; you are left with a few choices: Drink yourself to sleep so you don’t feel the pain, seek drugs so you don’t feel the pain, or kill yourself to stop the pain. Pain management isn’t covered in ER visits unless you’re having a heart attack from it or have gone into shock. Most Americans cannot afford anything but ER visits, because ERs cannot legally turn you down.
So do you have an actual choice in that scenario? Because half of working Americans by the age of 30 find themselves in that scenario. Nearly all drug addicts found themselves in similar scenarios.
If you want to stop drug addiction and abuse, and homelessness, then the solution is universal healthcare including mental health care, AND WORKER PROTECTIONS INCLUDING MINIMUM WAGE BEING SET TO THE COST OF LIVING.
Rightwingers would argue that starting drugs (and even continuing using on early stages) IS a choice.
Why are you arguing for them then? Addiction is well documented, it’s not like we don’t have any information on how drug dependence happens or how it influences people’s decisions.
When we did a homelessness study in our community we found out most homeless were not actually homeless. Many had a place to go but because of mental illness, addiction, and other circumstance could not go there.
We butted heads quite a bit with the business leaders and learned they got what they wanted regardless of community wishes. All of our seating was removed from our small town to prevent homeless from sleeping on benches. No one in the community wanted this except the businesses leaders.
Every time we would come up with a good plan it would be shot down. It became quickly apparent that the business leaders didn’t want to solve the problem. They just wanted to hide it.
In my humble opinion asking the question you have shows a high level of ignorance and callousness. This is because you are ignorant to the plight of homeless people and how this is connected to our society at large. Simply put, the homeless serve as a brutal reminder of what will happen to us if we don’t participate in our system the way the wealthy want us to.
I’ve been spit on, stalked, threatened, harassed by homeless people. More of my interactions with the homeless have been overall negative than positive.
And you know what? I still don’t fault them or think they deserve what they’re going through. I think everyone deserves a roof over their head and food in their bellies. Full stop. No ifs, ands, or buts.
The homeless are not “bad people” or lazy. They are people that are down on hard times and our society as a whole has failed them because they don’t live up to arbitrary expectations.
First off, I don’t know for sure who is or isn’t homeless.
A begger with a sign that says “homeless” might be lying. Tents can be second residences.
A homeless person can be reasonably, even well, dressed and/or working.
In your humble opinion, are the majority of the homeless people responsible for the situation they are in?
As I tend to believe in free will, ultimately yes.
IOW: do they deserve to be homeless, because it is their personal failure or do they not, because they are a victim of the circumstances (the reasons they are where they are are largely out of their control)?
Do smokers deserve to have cancer, do people who eat over 3000 calories a day deserve their obesity?
No in all 3 cases, but life choices might, or even probably, lead to such.
Have you ever talked to homeless people?
Probably.
Are they really just “bad people”
No if they don’t do bad things.
and “will never change”
I suppose some do.
I suppose most find a home, some never do, and a few die homeless.
or are they hardworking individuals who’ve just had a punch by life that they were unable to stand after?
I suppose that happens too.
Whats “free will” by you? In a sense that we can basically apply the logic of “he/she should have done x so y didn’t happen” same way we can apply the logic of “external circumstances made them do it” to basically ANYTHING. There’s always some alternative path (taking which can be attributed to “choice”) that a person could have undertaken to avoid an undesirable outcome. Crashed a car? = shouldn’t have driven (you CHOSE to sit behind a wheel). Killed someone? can be either “you chose to kill them” or “emotional turmoil, caused by their behaviour/you loosing your loved one blah blah blah made yoj do it”
Are they completely free of responsibility? Of course not. Did they wake up one day and say “I’m going to become homeless, see what all the fuss is about.”? Of course not.
I’m going to assume that nearly every person who’s homeless has some external factors like genetics (addiction, mental health etc), and some poor choices that led them to that situation. It’s very likely that a lot of the poor choices have their root in the mental health problems.
It’s exceptionally difficult to succeed in this world when you don’t have the tools to navigate it. A bad day for you might be permanently devastating for someone else.
I guarantee they have some disadvantage other people don’t.
My opinion is not humble and I find myself hating that my instance doesn’t allow downvotes. How is this even a topic of discussion in 2026. 🤮
